Thoughts on expanding my new layout?

Shortround Aug 21, 2022

  1. Shortround

    Shortround TrainBoard Member

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    I have been trying to figure out a better way to have my layout room. This is from the door with new layout on a 6'x2.5' table.
    upload_2022-8-20_17-55-13.jpeg

    The other side with the shelving I'm thinking of using.

    upload_2022-8-20_17-57-12.jpeg

    And the end opposite the window.

    upload_2022-8-20_17-58-14.jpeg

    I can take off the 3 higher shelves and make a 4th. I would use those as the four corners of a 4x8 sheet of foam. It would be kept away from the walls and the shelves are open mesh so getting wires down would be easy. The shelves are much more stable than the tables and offer shortage space. Then I could easily expand this little layout. :)
    What ya's think?
     
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  2. Sumner

    Sumner TrainBoard Member

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    Richard I'm a little confused. Are you going to remove enough of the shelf modules that you can move them to the center of the room and put the foam on top of them? How high would the layout end up. One or two shelves high? What thickness foam and what would be the largest unsupported span for the foam?

    If there is enough room to get around it I'd go for it. More space for tracks/scenery is usually good :).

    Here in my little town I can get a 4 x 8 sheet of foam and 1/2" cdx plywood for about $60 for both and a few 1 x 2's for a little more. Personally if you can go that route I think in the long run you would have a more stable and useable layout. You can put the plywood on the shelf modules and edge it with the 1 x 2's similar to ....

    [​IMG]

    ... what I did above and ( HERE ). The stiffens it up and protects the edge of the foam and gives you a slight lip or facial. I find that is nice for protecting the foam and giving you a place to rest the side of your are while working on things. Better than just the edge of the foam which is going to break away sooner or later if it isn't protected. A simple hand saw would work for cutting the 1 x 2's and also cutting two sides of the foam back 1 1/2" since the perimeter 1 x 2's are going to eat up a little room on top of the plywood. There are other ways you could frame the sides if you didn't want to loose that room but loosing 1 1/2 inches on the 4 x 8 sheet isn't much.

    [​IMG]

    Also later or now for not much more you could make a simple 1 x 4 frame for under the plywood, like above (more detail info HERE ) that would be easy to attach simple 1 X 4 legs to for probably less than buying a few of those shelf modules. All of this could be made with a hand saw (not that many cuts) and screwed together with grabber screws.

    Good to see you finding the time and the space to work/play with the trains,

    Sumner
     
    Last edited: Aug 21, 2022
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  3. Shortround

    Shortround TrainBoard Member

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    Sumner, Thanks for the encouragement. I do admire your skills and enthusiasm but, I have gathered too many restrictions. Along with age.
    I have to live in an apartment now and getting two bedrooms, washer & drier, garage and public transportation among them is a big advantage.
    The table the layout is on is fairly stable for a fold up. The shelving units are even more so and vented. Rearranged with three layers they are 38" tall. Out to the four corners they would be spaced 12" apart for 4' and 24" for 8'. And I'm left with a fifth unit. Putting a plywood sheet on and the units together would give more room for my big feet but not loose storage shelves.
    I would have prefered to stay with DCC HO but it will have to go to a small shelving switcher. So it's back to N and maybe DCC.

    Richard
     
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  4. Sumner

    Sumner TrainBoard Member

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    So does that mean you could do the plywood with the 1 x 2 edging? I just went out and played with some 1 inch foam. A 12 inch span might work but I wouldn't want to push to 24. Even at 12 inches without the edges being supported I'd be afraid that sooner or later I'd put an elbow or something on it and it would break.

    How are you going to transport the 4 x 8 foam board? I'd think that if you could transport it then the plywood could be a go also. I just feel in the long run you would be much happier using it under the foam. If transportation is an issue possibly there is someone on here who could help. We have a friend in Appleton, but they only have a small car but might know someone with a pickup.

    Sumner
     
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  5. sidney

    sidney TrainBoard Member

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    sid says go for it. build what makes you happy, because that's what makes all the difference in this crazy world.
    If you plan on running a few trains at same time I highly recommend DCC and for cheap you can build DCC+EX system (witch i also highly recommend(y) )
    either way definitely get the foam board if you can. See as you are apartment life you could build it so its portable in future moves 2 inch foam is very stout for this but more costly. if future moves are something that might happen i would build two 4x4 sections that could be separated if needed (much easier to move if needed) only you can decide whats best for you(y) many people build on fold up tables easy to move transport and you have that already. But that does make a challenge for wiring ect.......
     
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  6. Helitac

    Helitac TrainBoard Member

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    I'm guessing the shelf units are 18 x 36? Maybe hold them 6" in on the long side, then you're spanning 12" in the middle vs 24" if you go to the edge. I'm using 2" styrofoam, and try not to span more than a foot or so w/o support. (HO) The extruded stuff is more expensive, but it's a lot more rigid. I think if you can access both long sides and one end it'll be fine. I say go for it. The "rough" edge does present a problem, I'm hoping real duct tape, (not duck), will be the answer. Again, the more expensive EPS doesn't "shed" as badly, the little styro balls keep my vacuum busy during construction, but it's manageable. I'm working in HO scale, and get tempted to switch to N every few days, but I'd have to liquidate my current stuff to pay for the new stuff and take the hit, and rethink the time and place. Still, a continuous running option is seductive.
     
    Last edited: Aug 21, 2022
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  7. Shortround

    Shortround TrainBoard Member

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    I'm figuring that I should get a sheet of plywood cut down to 4x4s and edge it with 1x3s. Cut down the sheet of foam the same or get four 2x4 sheets. Place the shelving stacks inside the 1x3s and attach 4" strips of hardboard for facial and to secure the 4x4s together. Add a little shelf in the middle for the control panel.
    This will be placed about two feet from the walls to give me room for access. Also that computer is an antique junker so, it will leave. Giving me a work table. I have a new computer in the living room. The TV can go on top of the little drawer units.
    How's that sound? Hopefully quite enough for the neighbor lady.
     
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  8. Shortround

    Shortround TrainBoard Member

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    This is my main transport. And why I can't hall home the lumber needs by myself. I have a brother with truck and trailer that can sometimes give me help.

    upload_2022-8-21_18-34-20.jpeg

    The truck in back use to be mine. It's a loaded '98 Dakota. Notice what Wisconsin winters do to front fenders. The plastic lip and metal flew off at 75mph. Gave some folks a thrill.
     
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  9. sidney

    sidney TrainBoard Member

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    i can see a rack of lumber on that bike :D
     

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  10. Shortround

    Shortround TrainBoard Member

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    I did haul home the parts for my other trailer. The 30 some year old axle, wheels and hitch for a child hauler. At the hardware before they ran out I had sheet of 1/2 CDX cut in half. That half cut in half (2x4). Those cut down to 3' and one split to 1'x3'. Along with 1x2s cut to 4' longs. All strapped down.
    That built a 2'x3' box with 1' high sides. It hauls many heavy/dirty loads.
    The one shown is for laundry, groceries, etc. May not use it much with the fold up side baskets and the new removable basket on the rack. I'm also replacing the headlight, tail light and making turn signals. Just have to figure out how to add a brake light.
    Weekend is over. Time to get back to retirement work.
     
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  11. Helitac

    Helitac TrainBoard Member

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    I always have the problem of finding someone to operate the really nice crosscut and panel saws at my close by Orange and White store. I live in a 3rd floor climb up apartment, and life is so much better with good power tools and the space to use them.
     
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  12. Sumner

    Sumner TrainBoard Member

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    Sounds like you have a good plan for a solid layout :).

    Love the electric bike. We love ours and try and ride them almost daily. Like that I'm still getting exercise but can go anywhere and not worry if there is a hill or not. Gave up on riding the conventional bikes a year ago. We are in a small town so use the bike to go about everywhere and sometimes don't use the car for 8-10 days at a time.

    We are going to need pictures as you build all of this ;)

    Sumner
     
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  13. BigJake

    BigJake TrainBoard Member

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    The extruded foam panels (usually blue or pink, depending on which home center you got it from) are better to work with. The extruded panels also are stronger/more durable than the (usually white) styrofoam panels.

    I think building this on top of your shelves, with a 38" height, is a great idea. A sheet of CDX (sheathing) plywood under the foam is ok, but with the shelves the way you mentioned, and N scale (and extruded foam), I think you will be just fine without it. You can slide the shelves in toward the middle if you are not happy with the support.

    You also have the above-stated option of putting one end up against the wall. This might have the advantage of being over a wall outlet, so you don't have to run an extension cord across the floor to the layout (and then trip over it countless times.)

    The CDX plywood, beyond supporting the foam across gaps in between shelves, also gives you a nailing surface (the edge of the plywood) for wood trim around the edges. Then you could place the shelves underneath however you want (but around the edges gives you the most access to them.) However, I hope you will have a space where you can get in behind the shelves, for when (not if) you push something off the back of a shelf, into the middle under the layout.
     
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  14. Shortround

    Shortround TrainBoard Member

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    I will be looking for the extrude foam boards. I know they are the strongest. The underlying board should be thin like a sheet of cheap paneling with 1x3s along the edge to stiffen and give a place to attach a facia board. I have a sheet of old peg board I'll cut into 1ft. strips to attach to the backs of the shelving to prevent pass throughs. Only one end will be up close to the window wall and the cords can go under a special tapered step on cover.
    I'm also spending money on upgrading that bicycle so finding and get the stuff home will have to wait a while. Hopefully before winter arrives.
    Thanks for your thoughts.
    Richard
     
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  15. Shortround

    Shortround TrainBoard Member

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    The one BIG problem now will not go away, willingly! Now I don't have all that work space for other projects. The little table and inside the loop is full of stuff.
    upload_2022-8-27_7-28-55.jpeg
     
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  16. BigJake

    BigJake TrainBoard Member

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    It's always something.

    Sometimes we sing to the tune; sometimes we just hum it...
     
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  17. BigJake

    BigJake TrainBoard Member

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    Richard,

    So, what if you compromised, to something like 30" deep (like 30x96") up against a wall, with fewer shelves under it (than the 4x8) and still room left to give you a workspace in the middle of the room?

    Or if you use a (bent) dog-bone type layout (thin in the middle, wider for larger radius curves at the ends, but the "shank" of the bone is pushed to the rear of the long side), it would give you a lot of the layout room and broad curves of a 4x8, but allow you to "walk into the middle" a bit to reach the whole layout from the middle and ends, allowing it to be used up against a wall.

    With the layout against the wall, you save the floorspace that would have been for walking around behind the layout, which could go towards your work/activity bench for your other activities.

    Also, think about mounting your layout at maybe arm-pit height, and put your workbench (for use while seated) underneath it.

    Lots of ways to 'skin this cat'...
     
  18. Shortround

    Shortround TrainBoard Member

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    But, I must first be "weary of the Cat" and be quick. I also need the storage and the height is already maximum.
     

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